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Bruce Kronenberg: Just a question for you guys. How would you describe the evolution of rates over the past few years? Has there been any kind of evolution at all? I mean considering what we’ve been talking about for the past 45 minutes is that question pertinent to this panel?
Tommy Griffiths: That’s one where you have to really use math to figure that out and you’d have to track the prices of, you know, other commodities and services and actually figure for, you know, cost of living adjustments and all that to figure that out. So it would just be a wild guess, but it seems like with the – now, from the union standpoint that’s different. I’m talking about non union rates.
Bruce Kronenberg: Right.
Tommy Griffiths: It seems like it’s been all over the place.
Bruce Kronenberg: It hasn’t – there’s been no progression in other words. It’s just –
Jim Kennelly: – Well, I think they’ve dropped. We’ve seen them drop, but I do believe they are stabilizing now. We’ve seen – I personally believe we’ve seen the low end and now they’re going to stabilize and rise as the people in the – people who are in the industry are going to shake out. It’s going to be more difficult for people to make a living so you’ll see a number of people leave the industry, talents leave the industry.
Naomi Mercer: But don’t you think that as that number leaves there’s always going to be a new influx to fill in that bottom part that – and they’ll continue to shake out just like you’re saying? Because I agree with you, but then I also feel like that lower end of the price spectrum will always exist. I don’t know.
Jim Kennelly: Well, yes. You’re right, Naomi. There will always be a lower end, but the tier of professional best production partners who are online talent is going to solidify. And as a producer who reaches into that talent pool all the time, I’m looking for really talented people. And at that point I’ll be able to sell back to my clients at a higher rate to say that these people are worth it. So I think rates are going to rise. I also see a prediction in that there’ll be more hourly rates for voice over talents. We see that with Pandora. We’ll see that grow with – when ads are more on podcasts and Snapchats. We’re going to see the hourly rate come in, but that hourly rate will be a pretty good rate.
Bruce Kronenberg: But is that going to be a set rate, Jim – Jim Kennelly: – set rate.
Bruce Kronenberg: – for like any job?
Jim Kennelly: It’ll be [a] rate between producers and talent. Bruce Kronenberg: But isn’t that sort of like the union then? Isn’t that – Jim Kennelly: – No. Hourly rate won’t be a union rate.
Bruce Kronenberg: No, no. But I mean isn’t that a standard being set as opposed to rates being per job like they are with non union work, most non union work anyway?
Jim Kennelly: Well, you see a big – a big … Pandora needs a lot of ads obviously. So they hire people on an hourly basis and that’s been established for a number of years now and it’s very well received by the talents. The talents who are Pandora voices, that’s good work. You know, it’s good, steady-based work. And I just think you’ll see that whether it’s Snapchat or other platforms like that hire talent in that way. But it has to do with the way freelancers are being hired in the United States and certainly voice-overs, voice over talents are a freelance pool.
Tommy Griffiths: And there are so many other categories of voice over pools or voice rosters that are out there that we’re not even talking about. Like these product companies that will offer their own roster of voices that say a TV station or a radio station needs a promo done can choose from and then they have their own rates that they pay their own people. Say they have 20 male voices, 20 female voices and what the pay is what they pay. And if you want to be part of that, you know, that’s up to you. That’s a totally –
Guy Michaels: – One of the – one of the areas … Tommy Griffiths: – Pardon me?
Guy Michaels: One of the areas that has dropped very dramatically, I believe, is narration. So the audio book world and as far as I’m concerned that’s dropped through the floor. The standard rate in the U.K. is around about 60 pounds per finished hour. It’s dropped ridiculously. And many –
Bruce Kronenberg: – And what do you attribute that to?
Guy Michaels: I would attribute that there is a massive demand for audio books. Audio books, you know, is a hugely growing market. The way in which – of course, yeah, we listen to audio books more so than we ever did and we can listen to them on a phone, etcetera, etcetera. And there is a lot of pressure from Amazon and the owners of these – the rights of these now to get it finished. And I know narrators who go into a studio and have to do four or five hours solid per day churning out and that rate has gone down and there’s a studio I was speaking to recently and they said that’s –
Naomi Mercer: – Well, I would think the demand is going up.
Guy Michaels: There’s a load more work, but the rate is going down dramatically. Bruce Kronenberg: Naomi, you were going to say something?
Tommy Griffiths: Demand would make the rate go down of course, but he’s saying that they want the stuff now so they’ll take lesser talent to complete the job.
Guy Michaels: Yeah. They’ve got to get it out, yeah.
Kabir Singh: – I think the evolution of rates like there’s a negative and positive to it and being – having your business you got to see what your standard of living is and what standard of living you want. I clearly – I’m not part of the union, however, I do know that many people talk about especially making
$20,000.00 on, you know, on a small ad or a campaign. Those – that’s becoming less and less common, but that doesn’t mean that you can’t be someone who starts and hones your craft and really builds your business who can’t make 50, 60, $100,000.00 on these online casting sites and local agents and your own hustle. You can have that standard. You can have that life. You can. And it all depends on what tier of that you want to reach. I personally want to reach higher, higher. Every time I can go higher. I would like to hustle and grind and learn more and keep going higher.
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