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Bruce Kronenberg: So a question here. I’m going to sort of take a question that was written here but kind of turn it around based on the way this panel’s been going. If you guys could give any advice to someone about rates who is just starting in this business … Who wants to take a stab at that?
Toby Ricketts: I’ll go. I would –
Bruce Kronenberg: – Some of you – because most of you are pretty established at this point.
Toby Ricketts: I would say the most empowering thing that I have learned and I wish I’d learned earlier is to figure out what your lowest rate you’re prepared to work for is and stick to it. And the first time you turn down a job because they want you to do something and you’re not – and you know, you’re worth more than that, the first time you turn that down is the most empowering moment in your voice over career and that was the tipping point for me.
Kabir Singh: Great point. That’s a great point. Bruce Kronenberg: Kabir, you want to add to that?
Kabir Singh: I would say you have to respect your life circumstances. Keep your life circumstances in full focus and perspective when you’re starting out. You know, if you’re coming from a minimum wage job, if you’re coming out of college debt like I was, keep your life circumstances and understand you got to set goals. You may be making $100.00 job right now. It may take you two hours which is better than your minimum wage job. However, set – research and become – immerse yourself in the knowledge and set your goals for man, in two years I want to be at the level of making $100,000.00 off of this because I’m going to be increasing my rates in respect of the industry and respect of everybody else.
Bruce Kronenberg: How about you, Naomi? Go ahead.
Naomi Mercer: Yeah. I would bring it full circle about what I said before that don’t get too upset about it or stressed about it and remember that negotiation can be fun and can be just a game at the end of the day and that will help you to just keep things in perspective too. But also to keep in mind, you know, every – I think that both Kabir and Toby had great points and I agree with them too.
Carrie Olsen: And I think, you know – yeah, going on with what Toby said, just don’t be afraid to bid what you think that a job is worth because I think that a lot of new voice actors the problem that they’re having isn’t that they’re not willing to take the lower job because I think maybe they’re more willing to take them sometimes, you know. So just don’t be afraid to – you know, have a mentor. Have someone you can talk to you that can – you can kind of weigh and say like is this worth it? Is this a good decision? And just don’t be afraid to bid. And like Toby said, if they turn you down because you’re not willing to do the work find something else, you know, that’s okay, but keep your standards.
Bruce Kronenberg: Tommy, what do you have to say about that?
Jim Kennelly: I think as a new talent, as a young talent, you have to be occasionally willing to lose a little revenue to have a better experience.
Kabir Singh: Absolutely.
Jim Kennelly: And production is push and pull. Production gives and takes. That’s what it’s all about.
Kabir Singh: Yup.
Naomi Mercer: Yeah.
Bruce Kronenberg: So Jim, what would you say to someone who was just starting in terms of rates, how to set them for themselves?
Jim Kennelly: Well, I think Kabir is correct. You have to look at some of the available listings on different sites where there’s generic price ranges, but then I’d be willing to, you know, occasionally take a little less money to have an experience with a good production company, a good producer, a good director because you have to get experience. You have to work at this business to grow in this business.
Bruce Kronenberg: How about you, Tommy? What do you have to say?
Tommy Griffiths: Again, along the lines of what Kabir had to say, take your own situation into account and is this the first job you’ve ever had or the first job you’ve ever received doing voice over? You have no other work. They want you to do three hours of work for 50 bucks. Why wouldn’t you do it? Why wouldn’t you get that first job under your belt?
Bruce Kronenberg: For $50.00.
Tommy Griffiths: You’re shooting for 75 bucks or 100 bucks but you got your first job, you’ve established a relationship with a company. They could come back and hire you again. So you know, you got to be flexible and I think Jim was saying that earlier. When you’ve been –
Toby Ricketts: – Kind of get paid in experiences.
Tommy Griffiths: – in this business as long as Jim has for 30 years, you got to kind of ebb and flow with what’s going on.
Kabir Singh: That’s a perfect quote, man. If I could just say, man, like if you’re doing it for the love … Like I love going playing basketball. If someone said Kabir, I’ll give you $20.00 an hour to go play basketball for ten hours a day, I might go do it because I love basketball that much. So keep that love and that art and that passion, keep it in perspective and don’t let that go.
Bruce Kronenberg: Right. That’s great. That’s great. Ben, what do you have to say about that?
Ben Jackson: I would say spend the time to figure out what your pricing structure is going to be. So whether that be, you know, sit down for an hour, two hours, two days, I’m not sure. Get the industry information because when, when – I call up and speak to voice talents quite often and a lot of the time they’ll push back on me and say well, what would you charge for this? How much do you think I should charge?
Bruce Kronenberg: Right. I was going to ask that too actually, yeah.
Ben Jackson: Because they just don’t know and they haven’t taken the time to go and figure it out. So get the information out there and find kind of those industry rates and figure out do you want to be right in line with the industry rates, do you want to be a little bit lower, little bit higher, and then understand that hey, you know, I’m willing to negotiate and I’m willing to walk away from some deals, but at the end of the day you have to sit down and figure that out whether it be with yourself or with your mentor or with, you know, people that you know and respect. But at the end of the day you do need to sit down and figure it out.
Bruce Kronenberg: So like before a new voice over artist is asked the question “So what are you rates?” should they have something ready to say and not $50.00?
Ben Jackson: Well, you know what we do? A lot of the time is it depends on who you’re talking to because if you’re talking to a client a lot of the times I’ll like to ask what’s your budget to kind of have an idea. So you might not know but their budget might be $5,000.00 and you’re thinking it’s $1,000.00. So ask the budget rate off the bat. But you should understand and kind of have a base point of where you want to go so if they push it back on you again then you’re like okay, well, this is what it typically is and this is why I charge this way.
Naomi Mercer: Yeah. I should have been more specific earlier.
Jim Kennelly: That’s exactly what I – when I call the top talent agents in New York and LA or Chicago or London about someone they represent the very first question they ask me is what’s in your budget. They ask it every time. So no matter who you are in the voice over industry, where you are in the voice over industry don’t feel afraid to ask that question. Hey, what’s in your budget? From there you start your negotiation.
Naomi Mercer: Yeah. And I should have been more specific earlier when I was saying that I don’t set rates. I set loose rates, you know. I have in my mind my own range of rates of per word, per minute, per regional spot, per – you know, for every type of job. I just don’t have it publically …
Kabir Singh: And if I could just say like your knowledge is key. You have to go research and get this knowledge before you start playing this game. You can’t go play the game without the knowledge. You don’t know the rules. You don’t know how everybody else is playing. Get your knowledge and then earn your way up to get those rates that you feel like you deserve or want and there’s plenty of resources for you to get the knowledge.
Ben Jackson: Yeah. And I’m not saying like go ahead and post your rates once you find them because there are a lot of factors involved when you do price something out. So but you should be aware of kind what those – you know, what you would charge for something.
Kabir Singh: That’s business savvy.
Bruce Kronenberg: I think we’re at time. Are we at time, Ben?
Ben Jackson: I think we’re close. Yes. I’m getting the thumbs up. Guy Michaels: Bruce, can I just say – can I just say something? Bruce Kronenberg: Yes. Sure. Go ahead.
Guy Michaels: In my experience the voice over industry is a very, very friendly, warm and supportive industry, almost like […]. So go out – like Kabir said, go out and seek that knowledge by joining a community, by going online, joining some group and sharing that knowledge when you’re in a position to and finding out people will help you. People will help you. We have lots of communities over here. We have networking events over here where we can meet up face-to-face. There must be something in your area where you can go and meet –
Bruce Kronenberg: – Oh, yeah. We have them. We have them right at my business. So yes, you’re absolutely right about that.
Kabir Singh: If I can just add one button to that. I promise you – look, I would not be even here if it wasn’t for other people. If it wasn’t for people who’ve helped me, help me become better, give me knowledge, teach me where to go, help – man, there are countless people that would help you. You just have to be open minded and ask them for help.
Toby Ricketts: And it’s worth putting the time in because let’s not forget, this is the best job in the world, right?
Bruce Kronenberg: That’s right. Here, here.
Jim Kennelly: I would also add it’s important to be nice to everyone. That’s from my experience. The person who emails you the script today is going to be the creative director or in charge of a big company down the road.
Bruce Kronenberg: And I was always nice to Jim. That’s why we’re still friends after 30 years.
All right. I think we’re good, right?
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